Stokesy's Tiger 1 (Early) Production

[Stokesy44]

Paintwork looks good to me mate, but you're definitely right about armour being more forgiving on these things than planes are.

Looks great so far Stokesy!
Paul

Thanks Gentlemen

Got the camo down today, I'm going for a two-tone scheme on a vehicle based in Italy in 1943. Its a bit rough in places so I will tidy it up with some of the base yellow to sharpen it and blend where needed. I'll then give it a spray of buff to calm it all down prior to decals and filters etc.











Oh and I need to paint the wheel rims which is going to be an absolute PITA!



When I work on the yellow I'll break up the camo on the turret, it doesn't look right at the moment, it kind of got away from me as I was working on it







For the most part the camo edges are nice and tight. I haven't done freehand camo for a while so it took a bit of time to get my technique right and the hand eye co-ordination going properly. Still, all things considered I did enjoy the session and the result is ok.





Plan for the morrow is camo tidy up, varnishing the tracks (planned for today ) and the wheel rims - Lord help me!

[ElCapitan]

It's looking good, shouldn't need too much tidying up if you ask me!

[Tomcat64]

What Rob said! That looks really good to me for freehand work mate - don't do a Tomcat and nause it up trying to fix what doesn't need fixing!

[Stokesy44]

It's looking good, shouldn't need too much tidying up if you ask me!

What Rob said! That looks really good to me for freehand work mate - don't do a Tomcat and nause it up trying to fix what doesn't need fixing!

Thanks guys, it just needs a little tidying up, I’ll be restrained when I have a look tomorrow, rest assured, no nausing up, Stokesy promises.

[TheNordus]

I really like how that camouflage looks. Only parts that really need tidying up are on the front plates I'd say. I advise caution on giving it a buff overspray, in my opinion the grainy look it can give a paintjob looks pretty bad.

[Stokesy44]

I really like how that camouflage looks. Only parts that really need tidying up are on the front plates I'd say. I advise caution on giving it a buff overspray, in my opinion the grainy look it can give a paintjob looks pretty bad.

I’ll see how it goes. I definitely want to apply some kind of filter to it, or maybe some paint fading. I want to ensure the colours are light enough ahead of weathering. Otherwise the tank ends up too dark when it’s finished.

[demarcation]

Great work, camo looks brilliant!!

[Stokesy44]

Great work, camo looks brilliant!!

Thank you kind Sir

[TheNordus]

I really like how that camouflage looks. Only parts that really need tidying up are on the front plates I'd say. I advise caution on giving it a buff overspray, in my opinion the grainy look it can give a paintjob looks pretty bad.

I’ll see how it goes. I definitely want to apply some kind of filter to it, or maybe some paint fading. I want to ensure the colours are light enough ahead of weathering. Otherwise the tank ends up too dark when it’s finished.

Tell me how it goes, I tend to struggle with my dark yellow turning, well, yellowed after I put on a few layers of filters, washes and weathering. I've heard using buff as a replacement for dunkelgelb might produce good results, but I'm not sure.

[Stokesy44]

Tell me how it goes, I tend to struggle with my dark yellow turning, well, yellowed after I put on a few layers of filters, washes and weathering. I've heard using buff as a replacement for dunkelgelb might produce good results, but I'm not sure.

I learned the hard way in that regard. I try to avoid the yellowing by only using white and light greens when I dot filter, particularly on a two colour camo like this one. Yellow is such a bright colour it tends to dominate the other filters, its a bully!

If I apply an overall filter it will not have any yellow in it, maybe a light brown cut with white and sprayed as a fine mist

I'm definitely going to lighten both camo colours first by using the base colours and a touch of white, nothing too drastic as it tends to stick out a mile if overdone, just a very diluted mix and subtle tones.

Whatever happens it will be fun. As much as I enjoy the build process with AFVs, once I get into the painting, its feels good to be creative and try to create the effects I want.

[DrSprue]

Oh wow that camo looks awesome Stokesy!! Im still not into tanks but its getting so addicting looking at all these posts.

(please doc, no tanks..no tanks... do not look anymore AFV builds... no, no. Dragon is just a cool sprue maker, Tiger is just an animal... no tanks..no tanks!)

[Tomcat64]

Oh wow that camo looks awesome Stokesy!! Im still not into tanks but its getting so addicting looking at all these posts.

(please doc, no tanks..no tanks... do not look anymore AFV builds... no, no. Dragon is just a cool sprue maker, Tiger is just an animal... no tanks..no tanks!)

[DrSprue]

Oh wow that camo looks awesome Stokesy!! Im still not into tanks but its getting so addicting looking at all these posts.

(please doc, no tanks..no tanks... do not look anymore AFV builds... no, no. Dragon is just a cool sprue maker, Tiger is just an animal... no tanks..no tanks!)

I cannot be progrommed for that!!!!

[Stokesy44]

Anyway, back to MY tank on MY thread!

I started off with the yellow as previously mentioned, cleaning up the camo where it had got away from me yesterday. Once I was happy I added a bit of white to the mix and faded the paint a tad. Its a new process for me and the result is a little bland, more AB skill required me thinks.

Once that was done I cleaned up the green a little, careful not to replicate yesterday's efforts and find myself back to square one

Once I was finished with the green I applied a filter of very diluted khaki grey (looks like light brown to me). Finally, to neutralise any potential yellowing, I applied a diluted white filter and pronounced myself happy(ish).















Tigger's now ready for some glossing ahead of decals.

[Tomcat64]

Anyway, back to MY tank on MY thread!

Really nice work on the camo again mate - that's coming along very nicely indeed

[DrSprue]

hehe!! Yea tho Stokesy, that camo work is really quite amazing!
And your getting that compliment from a intermediate dude as well!

[Stokesy44]

Thanks, you pair of wags

[TheNordus]

You got a real nice tone of Dunkelgelb there. Did you plug up the MG hole on the turret or is that a defect on the kit?

[Stokesy44]

You got a real nice tone of Dunkelgelb there. Did you plug up the MG hole on the turret or is that a defect on the kit?

Thanks, the kit comes with a plug for the MG port. I'm not a Tiger expert so I tend to go where the instructions take me.

[TheNordus]

You got a real nice tone of Dunkelgelb there. Did you plug up the MG hole on the turret or is that a defect on the kit?

Thanks, the kit comes with a plug for the MG port. I'm not a Tiger expert so I tend to go where the instructions take me.

I've never heard of a plug being put there myself. Makes sense for the waterproofing procedure that they had. Highly doubting anyone used those outside training exercises though. I keep forgetting this is a Dragon kit and not the Tamiya one

[Stokesy44]

You got a real nice tone of Dunkelgelb there. Did you plug up the MG hole on the turret or is that a defect on the kit?

Thanks, the kit comes with a plug for the MG port. I'm not a Tiger expert so I tend to go where the instructions take me.

I've never heard of a plug being put there myself. Makes sense for the waterproofing procedure that they had. Highly doubting anyone used those outside training exercises though. I keep forgetting this is a Dragon kit and not the Tamiya one

That's interesting, I put the plug in because I thought it was something specific to the tank I'm building, if its just a bung to keep the water out I should have left it off. Oh well, you live and learn. I was just trying to navigate my way through the multiple sprues and Dragon's byzantine instructions!

[HIghAltitudeScale]

I like what you have done and seeing more armor on the site is great. Keep up the great work.

[TheNordus]

That's interesting, I put the plug in because I thought it was something specific to the tank I'm building, if its just a bung to keep the water out I should have left it off. Oh well, you live and learn. I was just trying to navigate my way through the multiple sprues and Dragon's byzantine instructions!

I just checked the instruction sheet and it does just tell you to put the Machine Gun plug there. Kinda weird to me that it isn't explained at all, but then Dragon usually doesn't. After some quick googling I couldn't find any information on this, however everything I've read says that Tigers ALWAYS had a machine gun mounted co-axially so I must presume it's part of the 'wading equipment'. Of course you don't have to take my word for it. I would have probably put it in there myself and thought about it only after the glue had set.

[Stokesy44]

Well, today was one of those days where I realised, yet again, that I am nowhere near as smart as I think I am.

Following some back and forth with Tommi (TheNordus) I was looking at a Tiger I built a while ago for reference this morning as I planned to drill out the co-ax plug I had mistakenly inserted. On inspecting the tank, and looking at Tommi's current Tiger WIP I noticed I had made a major balls up with my wheels.

This is the balls up - I'm missing the 2 interlocking outer sets of wheels 8 per side are missing! I must have gone on some kind of intelligence safari during the build phase, misinterpreted the instructions and assumed these wheels were duplicates - it is a Dragon kit after all.



Its not the end of the world but for goodness sake, how much stoopid can one guy produce?

Off the sprues and sanded. Unlike previously, these wheels will be painted OFF the tank so I can do a decent job on the rims.



I drilled out the co-ax too. I figured it was a day for rectification!



Knowing the wheels currently on the tank will be masked by the additional ones I went about painting the rim areas which will still be seen once all the wheels and the tracks are on. I didn't need to worry to much about being neat with the edges - they will not be seen now.



While I had the black paint out I started work on the cables and tools. I also calmed down at this point and stopped calling myself names.







An interesting morning all things considered.

[TheNordus]

Looking really good there. Tigers certainly had an excessive amount of wheels. I believe when they moved on to steel-rimmed wheels they removed the outermost layer completely. The part of the pliers below the clamp and above the handles should also be black by the way.

[TommyKillander]

The Tiger looks better and better

Keep up the good work!


Tommy

[Quax]

It's looking wheely wheely good...

[Stokesy44]

The Tiger looks better and better

Keep up the good work!


Tommy

Thanks Tommy

[Stokesy44]

It's looking wheely wheely good...

you’re as funny as parachuting onto a cactus!

And thanks

[TheNordus]

It's looking wheely wheely good...

you’re as funny as parachuting onto a cactus!

And thanks

Parachuting into a cactus can be hilarious if you're just an onlooker though.

[Kevthemodeller]

The wheels, the wheels, the wheels I'm telling you the wheels...................

Never mind mate what makes it hard is units/crews often left wheels off deliberately and there's just so many of them

She's looking good mate

[Stokesy44]

The wheels, the wheels, the wheels I'm telling you the wheels...................

Never mind mate what makes it hard is units/crews often left wheels off deliberately and there's just so many of them

She's looking good mate

Wheels, wheels, you must learn wheels - Yoda, The Empire Strikes Back (paraphrased)

Thanks mate, I've seen lots of kits and pics of originals where some have been left off. I may get creative and leave one or two off, its all in the name of art!

[Tomcat64]

I was thinking the same as Kev with the wheels being left off - especially on the later ones.

No harm, no foul and as you said it makes the painting easier too

[Kevthemodeller]

I think it was mainly the front/back to stop mud and debris jamming the idlers and to easy track removal/replacement.

[Stokesy44]

I was thinking the same as Kev with the wheels being left off - especially on the later ones.

No harm, no foul and as you said it makes the painting easier too

But if I leave any wheels off I will need to repaint the one behind it as it would not have camo on!

[Stokesy44]

I think it was mainly the front/back to stop mud and debris jamming the idlers and to easy track removal/replacement.

Thanks for the info Kev

I think its good to screw up a build, you get to know the people who really know what they're talking about!

I need to plan this out if I'm going to leave a wheel or two off, I've headless chickened enough on this Tigger already!

EDIT - that wasn't sarcasm by the way. Advice when its helpful is always welcome.

[Tomcat64]

Ach! Sorry mate - I went back and looked again, I didn't realise that you'd camo'd the inner wheels as well.

Done some digging and although this is a II rather than a I it looks like the inside wheels on this were painted. My guess would be if the outside wheels were left off for any length of time in the field then there's no reason why the crew wouldn't put a camo pattern on the inners?

[Stokesy44]

Ach! Sorry mate - I went back and looked again, I didn't realise that you'd camo'd the inner wheels as well.

Done some digging and although this is a II rather than a I it looks like the inside wheels on this were painted. My guess would be if the outside wheels were left off for any length of time in the field then there's no reason why the crew wouldn't put a camo pattern on the inners?

Thanks TC

That's some really nice reference material for the tow cables and rods too. I was thinking about the colours they needed, I've painted the cables black as a base but they'll be lightened to look more like those on the Tigger II in your pic

[TheNordus]

Ach! Sorry mate - I went back and looked again, I didn't realise that you'd camo'd the inner wheels as well.

Done some digging and although this is a II rather than a I it looks like the inside wheels on this were painted. My guess would be if the outside wheels were left off for any length of time in the field then there's no reason why the crew wouldn't put a camo pattern on the inners?

Good image, but not really conducive for Tiger I, as Tiger II only had two rows of roadwheels against the Tiger Is approximately 16 layers per side.
Basically it's impossible to know how they did it unless you find an image of the actual tank you want to model. The best method I found is to take the turret number and the name of the tank to google, like "Tiger 1 S04", and maybe add the theater it's supposed to be in, like "Tiger 1 S04 Italy". Unfortunately this set only comes with decals for the S04 Tiger which supposedly is either Wittman's or his squadron buddy's tank. This one had all the roadwheels installed.

Generally I think if the tank would have been painted in camouflage in the factory, the inner roadwheels wouldn't have any camouflage on them even if the crew removed them, but if the camouflage was left up to the crew (more likely story) they'd remove the offending wheels first and then paint camouflage on the inner wheels.

I'm not trying to tell Stokesy how to build his tank though, I just like to spout historical tidbits I have gathered during my adventures on the interweb.

That's some really nice reference material for the tow cables and rods too. I was thinking about the colours they needed, I've painted the cables black as a base but they'll be lightened to look more like those on the Tigger II in your pic

I prefer to use tamiya's rubber black or German grey for towing cables, and usually I add some black wash. I've also got a bottle of Mig's "New wood" colour and I'm going to have a crisis when I run out of it, because it looks awesome as wood if you put some tamiya brown panel liner on it. Tamiya's Desert Yellow is also a good base for fresh wood though.

Sorry for the long post, I'm sleep deprived so my judgement isn't at it's best.

[Kevthemodeller]

Good image, but not really conducive for Tiger I, as Tiger II only had two rows of roadwheels against the Tiger Is approximately 16 layers per side.
Basically it's impossible to know how they did it unless you find an image of the actual tank you want to model. The best method I found is to take the turret number and the name of the tank to google, like "Tiger 1 S04", and maybe add the theater it's supposed to be in, like "Tiger 1 S04 Italy". Unfortunately this set only comes with decals for the S04 Tiger which supposedly is either Wittman's or his squadron buddy's tank. This one had all the roadwheels installed.

Here you go http://www.alanhamby.com/suspension.shtml scroll down to the 3 rd paragraph black and white drawing, to save costs and production time. What you done is spot on for 1944

Scroll down here http://www.fprado.com/armorsite/tiger1.htm you'll see several pictures with front wheels missing

[Stokesy44]

Good image, but not really conducive for Tiger I, as Tiger II only had two rows of roadwheels against the Tiger Is approximately 16 layers per side.
Basically it's impossible to know how they did it unless you find an image of the actual tank you want to model. The best method I found is to take the turret number and the name of the tank to google, like "Tiger 1 S04", and maybe add the theater it's supposed to be in, like "Tiger 1 S04 Italy". Unfortunately this set only comes with decals for the S04 Tiger which supposedly is either Wittman's or his squadron buddy's tank. This one had all the roadwheels installed.

Here you go http://www.alanhamby.com/suspension.shtml scroll down to the 3 rd paragraph black and white drawing, to save costs and production time. What you done is spot on for 1944

Scroll down here http://www.fprado.com/armorsite/tiger1.htm you'll see several pictures with front wheels missing

Great stuff, loving the reference data being shown here.

I think I am going to have to bite the bullet and put them on. The kit is an 'early' and dated as at September 43 so wheels off wasn't trendy at the time. I may leave one off for 'character' though.

As for specific vehicles, its not my thing. I'm not interested in building so and so's tank or Captain Whatshisname's P51. I try to build the kit as accurately as I can (hence drilling out the co-ax port) and to replicate the historical flavour of what the vehicle represents. I'm a history buff first, a kit builder second.

All power to those who are into specific examples, good luck to them, its just not for me.

Now I'm off to paint my cables

[TheNordus]

Here you go http://www.alanhamby.com/suspension.shtml scroll down to the 3 rd paragraph black and white drawing, to save costs and production time. What you done is spot on for 1944

Scroll down here http://www.fprado.com/armorsite/tiger1.htm you'll see several pictures with front wheels missing

Thanks for the links, this is really good reading.
"16 layers of wheels per side" was just an exaggeration on my side, I'm actually kinda amused to find out that that's the REDUCED amount of roadwheels per side on late model Tigers.
As for the removal of roadwheels, I did the thing where I removed the front outermost roadwheels on my Tamiya Tiger 1 mid production to model this 'modification', what I intended to say was that it was only select crews who removed the wheels and for example every photo (that I could find after a quick google search) of a Tiger with a turret number 'S04' shows that particular crew did not remove any of their roadwheels. This just in case the person building the tank cares about such things, no one here is going to pick nits about it.

[Stokesy44]

Too cold today for using the airbrush with the window open so I finished off the detail painting instead. Them wheels can wait a day

First up was the cable strung along the left side of the hull.



Then it was onto the tools and rods. I used Ultimate's Oxide primer mixed with shades of red and yellow for the various woods and Bakelite. I couldn't be arsed to go hunting around for all the browns and reds etc. when it was just as easier to mix the colours myself.









Finished off with the spare tracks on the turret. I used Vallejo metal colour burnt iron. The tracks will get rusted up later on when I break out the rust and oils.







Just the wheelie good bits left now

[DrSprue]

Wow that looks great!

[TheNordus]

Looking real nice there Stokesy. Fun fact: The handles for the pliers/cutters are often said to be made from Bakelite, but it's actually compressed paper dyed dark red with bakelite caps.

I gotta say I love the tone of brown you chose for the wooden handles.

[Quax]

It is looking good Stokesy, I think what you've done is the wheel format for transport tracks, the narrow ones they used to fit the railway cars. I think to get the outer wheels on you will have to remove the plates with the bolt heads in
Paul

[TheNordus]

It is looking good Stokesy, I think what you've done is the wheel format for transport tracks, the narrow ones they used to fit the railway cars. I think to get the outer wheels on you will have to remove the plates with the bolt heads in
Paul

(I got up from bed at 2am to post this)
Actually not, those flanges or plates or whatever you want to call them are supposed to be there even when the outer wheels go on. This is a detail missing in most Tiger 1 kits. You're right in that it's the transport track configuration though.

[Quax]

(I got up from bed at 2am to post this)
Actually not, those flanges or plates or whatever you want to call them are supposed to be there even when the outer wheels go on. This is a detail missing in most Tiger 1 kits. You're right in that it's the transport track configuration though.

I'm very impressed by your dedication!

You're right though, I looked back at the instructions for my mid Tiger 1 and that gives an either/or with the enclosed cap as the or. Fortunately Stokesy has used the either and not the or so should be ok. I think however Stokesy should now build a diorama with the Tiger being loaded onto a railway car....

Paul

[Stokesy44]

(I got up from bed at 2am to post this)
Actually not, those flanges or plates or whatever you want to call them are supposed to be there even when the outer wheels go on. This is a detail missing in most Tiger 1 kits. You're right in that it's the transport track configuration though.

I'm very impressed by your dedication!

You're right though, I looked back at the instructions for my mid Tiger 1 and that gives an either/or with the enclosed cap as the or. Fortunately Stokesy has used the either and not the or so should be ok. I think however Stokesy should now build a diorama with the Tiger being loaded onto a railway car....

Paul

Rest assured the additional wheels all attach to the existing connections. I think I really would have gone off the deep end if I had needed to remove them.

[Tomcat64]

So no railway wagon diorama then...

Great work on the pioneer tools and other assorted gribblie though, that is really starting to come to life.