Another MP4/6 super detail build

[Johnj]

[Johnj]

[BigWall]

Absolutely sick!

[Casper]

Incredible detail John and a superb build, a joy to watch

[Johnj]

Incredible detail John and a superb build, a joy to watch

Thanks guys. It is a lot of work but top studio has to get most of the credit. I showed a friend at work some of the pictures and he could not believe it was a model, i only convinced him when i pointed out it was sitting on a piece of kitchen roll lol.
If i had known paul had shelfed his, i dont think i would have started my own. I was only confident because i thought i had his build to follow if i became stumped.

The body panels have been prepped, primed and the base colour of white applied and i'll give them 24hr before i start to handle them for masking.
Thanks all for taking the time to have a look and all the positive comments

[Kevthemodeller]

More superb detailing work mate

[Johnj]

More superb detailing work mate

Thanks kev
Got a big problem i'm afraid and i need some help. Because it's a Tamiya kit i didnt bother to dry fit all the major parts before starting. Two of the critical parts for everything falling into place are the top mounting points on the cylinder heads which are replaced with resin one's. I'm still not sure where the actual issue comes from. The problem is that the bodywork/engine cover wont fit over the rear suspension arms. If you cast your eye along the bottom of the chassis/tub you can see the back of the engine is below the front. You can see it here with the airbox fitted there is a gap at the back.
I need to find a way of getting the top of the engine closer to the bulkhead. I cant take it off, there is just too much attached to it. It would almost certainly destroy the radiator pipe's/hose's and all that wiring. Did i mention i cant get to the screws that hold it on as the cockpit is now glued in, plus some of the front suspension is fixed to it.
This is a major blunder on my part, i feel sick to my stomach right now. I cant even look at it. If you guys have any suggestions, i'll consider anything right now. I may feel different in a day or two with a fresh pair of eyes.
Opening up the holes on the body would be a very last resort.
Thanks for taking a look boy's

[Johnj]

Here is a couple of pics of where it's at before i realised the disaster


You see absolutely nothing of the fire extinguisher when it's in place.


Just a bit of detail on the rain light for the back.

[BigWall]

The first thought that came to me is sand the bottom to where it will look flat then shim the bottom and the front and redo the decal. I think a bit of reshaping may be all you need for it to look proper.

Good luck! I'm sure you'll figure it out.

[digger303]

The first thought that came to me is sand the bottom to where it will look flat then shim the bottom and the front and redo the decal. I think a bit of reshaping may be all you need for it to look proper.

Good luck! I'm sure you'll figure it out.

I don't do cars, but that seems like a plan. The top piece behind the headrest would mate better too doing that. Maybe .07mm to be removed. Would need a flat surface to do it on to keep it even and not rounded.

[cor]

I feel your pain. That is great work so far . . . Im certain a solution will present itself. You just need time away for your mind to work it out. It will almost certainly involve a lot of fiddly work and some (more) swearing.

[Twokidsnosleep]

Pose it with the cowling off…you would want to anyways with a gorgeous engine and tubings like that
Or modify the cowlings. They look one piece. And I guarantee the real thing had the engine separate from the cockpit cover.
Is there some way to split up the rear cowling and mess with it to make things fit?

[Kevthemodeller]

More superb detailing work mate

Thanks kev
Got a big problem i'm afraid and i need some help. Because it's a Tamiya kit i didnt bother to dry fit all the major parts before starting. Two of the critical parts for everything falling into place are the top mounting points on the cylinder heads which are replaced with resin one's. I'm still not sure where the actual issue comes from. The problem is that the bodywork/engine cover wont fit over the rear suspension arms. If you cast your eye along the bottom of the chassis/tub you can see the back of the engine is below the front. You can see it here with the airbox fitted there is a gap at the back.
I need to find a way of getting the top of the engine closer to the bulkhead. I cant take it off, there is just too much attached to it. It would almost certainly destroy the radiator pipe's/hose's and all that wiring. Did i mention i cant get to the screws that hold it on as the cockpit is now glued in, plus some of the front suspension is fixed to it.
This is a major blunder on my part, i feel sick to my stomach right now. I cant even look at it. If you guys have any suggestions, i'll consider anything right now. I may feel different in a day or two with a fresh pair of eyes.
Opening up the holes on the body would be a very last resort.
Thanks for taking a look boy's

Hi John

I think I'm looking in the right place but not sure. You say "if you cast your eye along the bottom of the chassis/tub you can see the back of the engine is below the front." I can't see the bottom of the tub in the picture, which is below where the exhaust headers bend and off the picture. Perhaps an arrow or two?

I know what you mean about not dry fitting Tamiya parts especially when they appear to be a simple join, got caught out a good few times myself

[Johnj]

More superb detailing work mate

Thanks kev
Got a big problem i'm afraid and i need some help. Because it's a Tamiya kit i didnt bother to dry fit all the major parts before starting. Two of the critical parts for everything falling into place are the top mounting points on the cylinder heads which are replaced with resin one's. I'm still not sure where the actual issue comes from. The problem is that the bodywork/engine cover wont fit over the rear suspension arms. If you cast your eye along the bottom of the chassis/tub you can see the back of the engine is below the front. You can see it here with the airbox fitted there is a gap at the back.
I need to find a way of getting the top of the engine closer to the bulkhead. I cant take it off, there is just too much attached to it. It would almost certainly destroy the radiator pipe's/hose's and all that wiring. Did i mention i cant get to the screws that hold it on as the cockpit is now glued in, plus some of the front suspension is fixed to it.
This is a major blunder on my part, i feel sick to my stomach right now. I cant even look at it. If you guys have any suggestions, i'll consider anything right now. I may feel different in a day or two with a fresh pair of eyes.
Opening up the holes on the body would be a very last resort.
Thanks for taking a look boy's

Hi John

I think I'm looking in the right place but not sure. You say "if you cast your eye along the bottom of the chassis/tub you can see the back of the engine is below the front." I can't see the bottom of the tub in the picture, which is below where the exhaust headers bend and off the picture. Perhaps an arrow or two?

I know what you mean about not dry fitting Tamiya parts especially when they appear to be a simple join, got caught out a good few times myself

Hi kev, your correct, you cant see the angle the engine sits at in the picture i posted. I would need to take the floor back off. I havent done a great job of describing whats going on, i posted out of frustration when i should have slept on it. I wish i knew how to do the arrows and the like, it would help immensely but i do this with my phone i dont have a laptop or anything.
My very first reaction was scott's suggestion of displaying it with bodywork off and that might still happen.
I have a idea after giving it some thought but it's a long shot and i'll remove whatever i have to, to get a clear picture. I realise it's difficult to try and offer any help when you dont have the model sitting in front of you. I'll post a picture of the bodywork on

[Johnj]

The first thought that came to me is sand the bottom to where it will look flat then shim the bottom and the front and redo the decal. I think a bit of reshaping may be all you need for it to look proper.

Good luck! I'm sure you'll figure it out.

Joe and digger, yeah i thought it was that airbox that was needing adjusted when i first fitted it. It was about 10mm from and up from where it should be. I did tape a piece of 240 grit to a glass table to take it down a bit at the front, but it wasn't till i fitted the body cowling i realised it was the engine causing the problem. I do apologise for the confusion, i posted the picture to try and illustrate how much and which direction the engine has to move. I just hope i havent taken too much off it that when the engine is in the correct place i have a gap at the front instead of the rear.
Where is the 'bricking it' smiley
I do appreciate you taking the time to reply and for the suggestions

[Johnj]

I feel your pain. That is great work so far . . . Im certain a solution will present itself. You just need time away for your mind to work it out. It will almost certainly involve a lot of fiddly work and some (more) swearing.

Thanks, yeah, i'm just kicking myself for not trial fitting right at the start but the Top studio parts were as good a fit as the Tamiya kit parts. I've just measured the resin head mounting lug against the kit part and digger is spot on, 0.7mm is the difference
AAAARRRRRGGGGG !!!!!
Thanks for taking the time to have a look

[Johnj]

Pose it with the cowling off…you would want to anyways with a gorgeous engine and tubings like that
Or modify the cowlings. They look one piece. And I guarantee the real thing had the engine separate from the cockpit cover.
Is there some way to split up the rear cowling and mess with it to make things fit?

If it weren't for the small piece of bodywork that fits in between the driveshaft/suspension arms i would have no concern about removing (butchering) the 0.7mm from the top cowl.
If i can find a way to create some space to get a fine saw blade of file between the engine mounting lug i should be able to pull things back to where they should be.
I'll post my thoughts in a bit and see what you guys think from there.

This should show the issue.

[Johnj]

24hrs on and i have managed to get it to work out. The suggestions you guy's made turned out to be the solution so i cant thank you enough.
This time last night it came very close to being flung back in the box and back in the pile.
I managed to get the engine mounting screws loose with a tamiya screwdriver that most of us are over run with cut to fit in the cramped space and turned using a small spanner on the hex.


The bottom two screws are mounted from the outside so they were no problem.
Having the screws out meant i could remove some of the PE simulated mounting points. I removed the PE washers D24 from top and bottom and B5 from the top two. That alone was not enough unfortunately.


These body panels now fitted pretty good so i didnt do anything to them.


The top of the engine is held on with 1.6mm nuts. Tamiya even supply a small spanner for the job.




Kev, before i started the tweaking i could clearly see the rear of the engine was farther down and not parallel to the chassis/Tub. I wish i had taken a picture at the time.


Scotts suggestion of cutting the body was what i went with. I have .4mm masking tape and it was less than that i had to remove to get it to clear the suspension arms.
The last piece of the puzzle was the airbox which was sanded at the front a little bit more. It still has a slight gap but it would need to be pointed out to notice it.
Boys, again i can't thank you all enough for the help and even motivation, it would be very easy to just give up without a fight. Thank you

[digger303]

Glad you managed to wrest it from a possible junking it would have been criminal to lose it after all the work you put in.

[BigWall]

SWEET DUDE!!!!!!!!!!

Way to find the solution!

[Twokidsnosleep]

Oh great I am glad things worked out
I have absolutely never had a huge fitment problem assembling a car by addding something I shouldn’t and not test fitting

[cor]

Great news. On with the job.

[Kevthemodeller]

Now I can see what the issues were glad you got it all sorted John

[Johnj]

Oh great I am glad things worked out
I have absolutely never had a huge fitment problem assembling a car by addding something I shouldn’t and not test fitting

Yeah, me either scott.....only an idiot would do something like that

[Johnj]

Again, thanks for your help boy's. Another reason for doing these things on-line.....your never alone.

I've been giving it some thought and theres no way i could have predicted this. Tamiya does give you the little brackets and washers as molded detail which i did sand off. If i was to do another i would measure the tamiya chasiss/tub before removing the detail and also measure the three PE together and that would let you know how much has to be taken off in total. You could take off another couple of 10th's for the CA glue.
I just hope that someone benefits from this in the future. If it saves even one person from the work involved to sort it, then it has been worth the time to document it.
Thinking back, there have been warning signs back when the radiator pipes/hoses didn't reach the part of engine that they should. As it was a Top studio part, i put it down to that.

[Johnj]

A while back i had a PM from a Alan parker asking about the C/F templates for the Tamiya 1/12 Enzo i did a couple of years ago. From the time and date of the PM it looks like he only joined the forum to send the message. I know there is a Alan parker on the live shows. My gut feeling is it's two different people but in the outside chance that it is the same bloke, i have found them. If you still want them just PM me your address and i'll pop them in the post. Just a word of caution though, there are around 300 pieces and it's a substantial undertaking.

[DRUMS01]

I am beside myself every time I look at this build. It's one thing to have a good molded kit with detail, and another to have the commitment to add a "super detail" set; but it is something all together different to have the skills and fortitude to pull this off.

GREAT WORK SO FAR, Stunning!

Ben

[Johnj]

I am beside myself every time I look at this build. It's one thing to have a good molded kit with detail, and another to have the commitment to add a "super detail" set; but it is something all together different to have the skills and fortitude to pull this off.

GREAT WORK SO FAR, Stunning!

Ben

Ben, i really dont know how to respond, i'm hubbled indeed. To receive praise like that from someone of your ability is quite something
I had no idea you were following the build. It's good to have you along
Hopefully another couple of weeks and it should be done then i can spend the time catching up again with what you guy's are up to with your own builds. You know yourself how time just disappears on here. I was worried that the mclaren would drag on for years and never get done.
Again thanks for the lovely comment.

[Johnj]

The mounting screw that attaches the nose is not used, the stud that it screws into is removed when installing the front dampers but i forgot to fill the hole so i just need to touch up the paint and then i can finish the decals.


Just a couple with the floor on. I'm quickly running out of stuff to do. All that's really left is the 2k clear and wheels and tyres. There is a bit of touch up to be done but i'll do that last when i'm not having to fit or handle anything.
The sharp eyed of you will see the kevlar decal is not straight, it was until i had to sand the bottom to get it to fit. That shows how much i had to take off

[BigWall]

Anyone that looks at this and their take away is that the kevlar decal isn't straight needs to be slapped.

This build is brilliant to say the least.

[cor]

That is an amazing kit with the detail bits and a superhuman job to get it looking so real. Cant fault it. Amazing job man.

[Kevthemodeller]

Shame about the decal level due to the fit issues. Dare I say it you could strip them off and re-decal. Please don't swear at me, only a suggestion

[Johnj]

Anyone that looks at this and their take away is that the kevlar decal isn't straight needs to be slapped.

This build is brilliant to say the least.

Lol, thanks joe

[Johnj]

Shame about the decal level due to the fit issues. Dare I say it you could strip them off and re-decal. Please don't swear at me, only a suggestion

Na, no swearing kev. I appreciate your critical eye and i will almost certainly re-do it. The whole build has turned out better than i could have even hoped for. The kevlar decal is the only flaw and it's only an hour or so to rectify which is nothing compared to the build as a whole.

[Twokidsnosleep]

This was a fantastic build

I am sorry to gave only caught the live show on the replay or I would certainly have voted for you
Thank you for posting such a good a completed model on the forum side, so they didn’t moan about us not posting anything again

[Johnj]

I'm starting to think about the next build then i realised i have completely forgot to assemble the main ECU and i also need to fit the rain light at the back.

[Johnj]

I'm fortunate enough to have the other two kits from this era of F1.
It would be silly to do the Ferrari next then a year or so down the line Top studio produce detail sets for it as well.


The only set i dont have for the williams is the wing and undertray only because it's always out of stock. So far there has been no engine set but i would assume it's coming unless anyone knows different ?
Three out of the four sets i have all attach to the chassis/tub. Theres a ton of work to be done before i would need the engine set, if it is coming.

[Johnj]

This was a fantastic build

I am sorry to gave only caught the live show on the replay or I would certainly have voted for you
Thank you for posting such a good a completed model on the forum side, so they didn’t moan about us not posting anything again

Thanks scott yeah, it was the only reason i posted it for the live show forum section. Dan's words kept ringing in my ears "use it or loose it"
I have to say though, i just dont get it. Maybe you have an idea ?
All the guy's on the live shows are ISM-Ultimate die-hards through and through and yet they seem to favour another forum effectively (facebook) what is the big draw with facebook that they dont get on this forum ?

[digger303]

This was a fantastic build

I am sorry to gave only caught the live show on the replay or I would certainly have voted for you
Thank you for posting such a good a completed model on the forum side, so they didn’t moan about us not posting anything again

Thanks scott yeah, it was the only reason i posted it for the live show forum section. Dan's words kept ringing in my ears "use it or loose it"
I have to say though, i just dont get it. Maybe you have an idea ?
All the guy's on the live shows are ISM-Ultimate die-hards through and through and yet they seem to favour another forum effectively (facebook) what is the big draw with facebook that they dont get on this forum ?

Cause it takes 10 seconds longer to post a pic and have to use a photo host site, but all those posts you make on a build get lost and eventually removed and it is harder to find a particular build later even in a short time frame of a week if a lot of posts are being put up.

[digger303]

Marvelous build a real credit to you.

[Johnj]

Marvelous build a real credit to you.

Thanks digger. I appreciate all your input through the build right from the very start. A voice of reason

I take it your not a FB fanatic either

[Johnj]

There are a few PE fasteners to be added to the end plates of the front and rear wing and i'll post close-up pictures of the completed chassis when they are added just to finish the thread off completely. Here is a pic of all the bodywork and wheels attached for the first time. Everything fitted well considering the detail that is under it.

[BigWall]

[cor]

oh yeah. Looks like a race car. Love it. What a lot of work you've put into it, it will make a great display. Cant wait to see the final photos.

[Kevthemodeller]

Stunning John, just stunning

[Kevthemodeller]

Dan's words kept ringing in my ears "use it or loose it"
I have to say though, i just dont get it. Maybe you have an idea ?
All the guy's on the live shows are ISM-Ultimate die-hards through and through and yet they seem to favour another forum effectively (facebook) what is the big draw with facebook that they dont get on this forum ?

I don't do facebook or any other of the similar social media platforms, they hold no interest to me whatsoever and have no plans to ever be on them. Personally I'm not a fan of live shows, find them over complicated, too much like zoom/teams work related stuff and after a day of work related stuff the last thing i want to do is watch hours of live shows!

I'd also mention they can be very cut throat and can often turn nasty on those platforms, something you don't get on this platform. Cynically there's also a financial driver, as I believe those who host these blogs or whatever they're called, can earn substantial amounts, once the subscriber rate starts to increase.

[Johnj]

Dan's words kept ringing in my ears "use it or loose it"
I have to say though, i just dont get it. Maybe you have an idea ?
All the guy's on the live shows are ISM-Ultimate die-hards through and through and yet they seem to favour another forum effectively (facebook) what is the big draw with facebook that they dont get on this forum ?

I don't do facebook or any other of the similar social media platforms, they hold no interest to me whatsoever and have no plans to ever be on them. Personally I'm not a fan of live shows, find them over complicated, too much like zoom/teams work related stuff and after a day of work related stuff the last thing i want to do is watch hours of live shows!

I'd also mention they can be very cut throat and can often turn nasty on those platforms, something you don't get on this platform. Cynically there's also a financial driver, as I believe those who host these blogs or whatever they're called, can earn substantial amounts, once the subscriber rate starts to increase.

Sorry kev, i meant to reply to you weeks ago.
Yeah, i was under the impression that it was only views that determined what the add revenue would be, but they all make a point of asking for subs on every video they make so it must have a financial element to it somewhere.

I've had the remaining detail sets for the 14b on back order for a while now and they finally dropped through the door today. I went for the 'late' type on the engine set as it appears to have more coloured detail parts on the fuel injectors.
I probably should start another thread for this but i'll post it here for now.

[Johnj]

Can anyone recommend a suitable gold paint for the suspension actuators on the williams ?
The only gold i have is the tamiya X12, alclad pale gold and the mr hobby super gold 2 from the super metallic range.
Any and all suggestions welcome

[Kevthemodeller]

Can anyone recommend a suitable gold paint for the suspension actuators on the williams ?
The only gold i have is the tamiya X12, alclad pale gold and the mr hobby super gold 2 from the super metallic range.
Any and all suggestions welcome

I mix my own use the AK extreme range, or Tamiya LP paints or you could use Zero paints, who do a range of gold including a gold to match that use of bike front forks and other golden colour anodised components.

[Johnj]

Thanks Kev, Zero paints are my preferred weapon of choice. I've never had to find paint for the bike shocks as there has always been a detail set available