Kolibri 282 V6

Post by **digger303** » Mon Dec 02, 2019 12:27 pm

A very short overview of this interesting little craft as I don't want to bore you all to sleep.

The Flettner Fl 282 Kolibri ("Hummingbird") is a single-seat open cockpit intermeshing rotor helicopter produced by Anton Flettner of Germany. In 1940, the German Navy made a request for a naval helicopter, and the FL 282 deliveries began in 1942; by the next year, 20 prototypes were in service. The prototypes were build in different variants, one or two seater, closed or open cockpit, and other modifications. Based on the prototypes' success, plans to manufacture 1000 helicopters where approved; however, because the Kolibri was a Navy aircraft, they had little claim on production facilities and the plans to manufacture them were finally aborted due to allied bombing of the Flettner factories. Only three Kolibri survived the war; the rest were destroyed to prevent capture

This is the Miniart kit No 41001

They do such lovely instruction booklets all in color

Not many sprues, but with a lot of small finicky parts. I do like the way the clear parts and pe have there own little envelope

This is the upgrade set from Eduard No 32927

Some of the parts are duplicated parts Miniart suppied, but not many. Certainly a 100% better instrument panel. Whether the replacement fuselage panels are needed I am unsure atm in time. But I shall figure that out as I go.

Post by **Tomcat64** » Mon Dec 02, 2019 3:26 pm

Well that's something I didn't know existed until today - everyday in here is an education.

Will be watching with interest to see how this goes together

Post by **jmurphy18** » Mon Dec 02, 2019 3:57 pm

Very cool model Digger! Very nice find

Post by **Twokidsnosleep** » Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:31 pm

NOT volunteering to test fly that thing
Yikes!!!

Post by **Kevthemodeller** » Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:57 pm

That's a very interesting aircraft one rarely seen and it did enter service I believe albeit in small numbers

Good luck with the build mate

Post by **jmurphy18** » Mon Dec 02, 2019 7:38 pm

Twokidsnosleep wrote: Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:31 pm NOT volunteering to test fly that thing
Yikes!!!

ROTFL!!

Post by **digger303** » Mon Dec 02, 2019 9:37 pm

Twokidsnosleep wrote: Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:31 pm NOT volunteering to test fly that thing
Yikes!!!

There was a rumor that one of the German high command used a two seater model to escape the last days of the war.

Post by **DBMiller** » Tue Dec 03, 2019 1:08 am

Very nice choice!

Post by **RangerNeil** » Tue Dec 03, 2019 1:31 am

Damn - you got me again!! Another one to add to the list!!

Stash · Post by **bfrd** » Tue Dec 03, 2019 3:09 am

Are you sure that thing can hover? It looks like a red-neck lawnmower hold-my-beer contraption!

Post by **Stokesy44** » Tue Dec 03, 2019 9:44 am

digger303 wrote: Mon Dec 02, 2019 9:37 pm
Twokidsnosleep wrote: Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:31 pm NOT volunteering to test fly that thing
Yikes!!!
There was a rumor that one of the German high command used a two seater model to escape the last days of the war.

Cracking choice. I didn't know the Germans had a working gyro. Is this a real subject or a what if?

As for someone using it to escape Berlin - ooh I love a conspiracy. It certainly wasn't Georing, it wouldn't have got off the ground!

Post by **digger303** » Tue Dec 03, 2019 10:47 am

Stokesy44 wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 9:44 am
digger303 wrote: Mon Dec 02, 2019 9:37 pm
Twokidsnosleep wrote: Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:31 pm NOT volunteering to test fly that thing
Yikes!!!
There was a rumor that one of the German high command used a two seater model to escape the last days of the war.
Cracking choice. I didn't know the Germans had a working gyro. Is this a real subject or a what if?

As for someone using it to escape Berlin - ooh I love a conspiracy. It certainly wasn't Georing, it wouldn't have got off the ground!

Yes the jerries had gyro-copters , but this isn't one. It can truly hover just like any other helicopter except it doesn't have a tail rotor to combat the engine induced spin. What they did was design a frigging huge tail rudder that stopped that. So the whole thing looks weird and gyro copter like.

Post by **digger303** » Tue Dec 03, 2019 10:53 am

RangerNeil wrote: Tue Dec 03, 2019 1:31 am Damn - you got me again!! Another one to add to the list!!

What can I say I like the left of field machines.....no reason to not spread the enthusiasm

Post by **TommyKillander** » Tue Dec 03, 2019 9:55 pm

Wow! That looks like a really nice kit!

Best of luck with the build!

Tommy

Post by **digger303** » Wed Dec 04, 2019 2:43 pm

I'v been a bit slow as usual, but thought I had better post something seeing as some are nearly finished.

I have been going slower than normal trying not to stuff this one up. It has been a bit of a bugger trying to glue up the 4 sides to this fusalage as they had a slight bow and they didn't exactly have any guide pins. Probably more my fat thumbs. However one thing seems to be shining through is some places like with the engine body is a very loose fit. Then one bit is too fat and won't allow the connecting piece to lock in at all I may have to try to sand it down to at least half it's thickness. I'll show you with a pic tomorrow. I still like the kit despite these niggles.

Post by **Tomcat64** » Wed Dec 04, 2019 4:11 pm

digger303 wrote: Wed Dec 04, 2019 2:43 pm I'v been a bit slow as usual, but thought I had better post something seeing as some are nearly finished.

I have been going slower than normal trying not to stuff this one up. It has been a bit of a bugger trying to glue up the 4 sides to this fusalage as they had a slight bow and they didn't exactly have any guide pins. Probably more my fat thumbs. However one thing seems to be shining through is some places like with the engine body is a very loose fit. Then one bit is too fat and won't allow the connecting piece to lock in at all I may have to try to sand it down to at least half it's thickness. I'll show you with a pic tomorrow. I still like the kit despite these niggles.

Not as slow as some of us - although I did open the box today

Looks like you might have some tricky alignments on that, and probably the same problems that the original had too

Great to see it underway though

Post by **Kevthemodeller** » Wed Dec 04, 2019 5:08 pm

Tomcat64 wrote: Wed Dec 04, 2019 4:11 pm Not as slow as some of us - although I did open the box today

Post by **jmurphy18** » Thu Dec 05, 2019 3:33 pm

looking good here Digger!

Post by **Hawkmoon** » Thu Dec 05, 2019 8:02 pm

Nice start on the pram

Post by **digger303** » Wed Dec 11, 2019 3:10 pm

I'v slowly been plodding along in my usual ham fisted manner.
A lot of really small parts and I'v discovered the instructions aren't as easy as I first thought and locating points can be a little sloppy. Here's where I'm at with various sub assemblies that are not quiet completed yet. They many deal with the engine and the gearbox.

Please excuse the amateur photography and the out of focus shots. It's late and I'm tired and lazy now.

It may well end up looking like a pram Hawk the way I'm slopping glue around...

Post by **Twokidsnosleep** » Wed Dec 11, 2019 5:27 pm

Looking really good

The mouldings of the framework appear nicely done and square

Post by **jmurphy18** » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:08 pm

Cool looking build Digger!

Post by **TommyKillander** » Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:21 pm

Looks really nice, lots of tiny tiny details...

Keep up the good work!

Tommy

Post by **digger303** » Wed Dec 11, 2019 10:57 pm

Twokidsnosleep wrote: Wed Dec 11, 2019 5:27 pm Looking really good
The mouldings of the framework appear nicely done and square

There is some distortion in said frame work.

jmurphy18 wrote: Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:08 pm Cool looking build Digger!

Thanks

TommyKillander wrote: Wed Dec 11, 2019 9:21 pm Looks really nice, lots of tiny tiny details...

Keep up the good work!

Tommy

Lots of very tiny parts. I can barely hold them for clean up or placement.

Thanks guys

Post by **digger303** » Thu Dec 12, 2019 11:46 am

Operational Factoid
By 1943, twenty Fl-282s had been built and they were routinely being used by the Kriegsmarine for convoy protection and reconnaissance from ships in the Aegean, Baltic, and Mediterranean Seas. The helicopter was found to be especially valuable at dawn and dusk when pilots of fixed wing aircraft did not have good visual contact in the poor light. During the day observation was especially favorable in the Mediterranean where the clear water allowed the helicopter crews to 'see' submarines as deep as 130 feet. Once a sub was spotted the Kolibri could easily match the speed and course of the submarine task which was impossible for the fixed wing aircraft with stall speeds higher than the cruise speed of a submarine. The Fl-282 would then radio the sub's position to the convoy, and if a warship was dispatched to attack it, the helicopter would mark the target's position with a magnesium flash bomb or a smoke bomb. Unfortunately, little is known of the operational employment of the machine.

Post by **digger303** » Thu Dec 12, 2019 2:12 pm

Another sub assembly completed , well almost The joystick has been left off so I can fit the seat later. The only real problem here has been once again with the instructions not being clear as to where some parts fit. In this case it was the under seat lever linkage.

Post by **jmurphy18** » Thu Dec 12, 2019 2:36 pm

Looking good digger

Post by **Tomcat64** » Fri Dec 13, 2019 10:49 am

Well that's some complex, fiddly-looking pipework there - only to be tackled when sober I reckon!

And thanks for the Factoid too - I honestly had no idea about how these things were deployed - fascinating stuff.

Post by **digger303** » Sun Dec 15, 2019 1:35 pm

Tomcat64 wrote: Fri Dec 13, 2019 10:49 am Well that's some complex, fiddly-looking pipework there - only to be tackled when sober I reckon!

And thanks for the Factoid too - I honestly had no idea about how these things were deployed - fascinating stuff.

Thanks Tomcat.

I read that this kit is a tail sitter so I set about adding some weight where ever I can. Since so much of the forward area is open I'm rather limited. Having some lead wire I added some inside the instrument panel and behind the seat padding and used CA to anchor it.

Finished up some PE...Just hope it fits.

Glued up the rotor heads and blade....yes it has 2 sets of rotor blades on two different shafts

I'm a bit worried about it actually as I don't think the plastic will hold the weight of the blades for any period of time.

Development Factoid
The Kolibri's intermeshing rotors represented the fourth approach to solving the control and torque problems, after Bréguet's stacked coaxial counter-rotating blades, Focke's widely spaced counter-rotating blades, and Sikorsky's tail rotor. The Kaman Huskie, which saw U.S. Air Force, Navy, and Marine service during the 1950s and 1960s, and the Kaman K-Max single-seat aerial crane used this design in the 1990s. The design has not proven to be long lasting or popular. The biggest problems with this design are that the helicopters are slow compared to other types and the rotors endanger people on the ground.

READY for paint. In all truth if I had not wasted so much time today I could have most of it painted and assembled

Post by **jmurphy18** » Sun Dec 15, 2019 6:36 pm

Looking good here Digger. Your rotor work looks good & the PE!

Post by **RangerNeil** » Mon Dec 16, 2019 12:40 am

Thats coming on excellently - I'm really impressed by the PE work!! Definitely going to have to add one of these to the stash..

Of note: Kamov, now a part of RosVertol, use a similar principle with twin rotors off-setting the need for a tail rotor - but they use a common shaft rather than two seperate ones. Very popular with the Soviet/Rus-Fed Navy and Naval Infantry (Marines to you and I) as the lack of a tail boom makes for a nice compact machine to fit in deck hangers on the small ships.

Post by **Tomcat64** » Mon Dec 16, 2019 11:27 am

More good progress

Is there any way of reinforcing the weak point on the blades with wire of some sort or will that just stick out like a sore thumb?

Post by **digger303** » Mon Dec 16, 2019 12:48 pm

Tomcat64 wrote: Mon Dec 16, 2019 11:27 am More good progress

Is there any way of reinforcing the weak point on the blades with wire of some sort or will that just stick out like a sore thumb?

Been investigating that and took the plunge with my plastic nippers and the drill......now I'v got a right royal F***k up

I now realize I should have tackled it slightly differently

oh well

Stash · Post by **bfrd** » Mon Dec 16, 2019 2:03 pm

We have all been there and done that...

Post by **Tomcat64** » Mon Dec 16, 2019 3:18 pm

digger303 wrote: Mon Dec 16, 2019 12:48 pm
Tomcat64 wrote: Mon Dec 16, 2019 11:27 am More good progress

Is there any way of reinforcing the weak point on the blades with wire of some sort or will that just stick out like a sore thumb?
Been investigating that and took the plunge with my plastic nippers and the drill......now I'v got a right royal F***k up
I now realize I should have tackled it slightly differently
oh well

As Matthew said - we've all been there and done that

I'm sure you'll find a way of getting it sorted somehow

Post by **Twokidsnosleep** » Mon Dec 16, 2019 5:29 pm

You will figure it out....brass rod And tube can work wonders

Adding weight to instrument panel
YES!!!

You have saved my little Bell from tail sitting

Post by **digger303** » Mon Dec 16, 2019 11:46 pm

Twokidsnosleep wrote: Mon Dec 16, 2019 5:29 pm You will figure it out....brass rod And tube can work wonders

Adding weight to instrument panel
YES!!!
You have saved my little Bell from tail sitting

been trying the brass tube angle, but unfortunately the tube needs to be drilled out. I broke a lot of drills bits before I gave up on that. However just before I nodded off last night I realized I might just have some electrical do dads that might do the trick....

Post by **digger303** » Mon Dec 16, 2019 11:49 pm

bfrd wrote: Mon Dec 16, 2019 2:03 pm We have all been there and done that...

Tomcat64 wrote: Mon Dec 16, 2019 3:18 pm
digger303 wrote: Mon Dec 16, 2019 12:48 pm
Tomcat64 wrote: Mon Dec 16, 2019 11:27 am More good progress

Is there any way of reinforcing the weak point on the blades with wire of some sort or will that just stick out like a sore thumb?
Been investigating that and took the plunge with my plastic nippers and the drill......now I'v got a right royal F***k up
I now realize I should have tackled it slightly differently
oh well

As Matthew said - we've all been there and done that

I'm sure you'll find a way of getting it sorted somehow

Post by **digger303** » Sat Dec 21, 2019 2:28 pm

Been a while since I updated, but I have been doing a little each night or two.
I was trying to fix my rotor problem and I decided on this course of action not knowing what else to try. Not having the right size brass tube on hand and after breaking numerous drill bits trying to enlarge the centre of the tubes so that they fit inside each other . I abandoned that course of action and went searching through my shed and found these electrical end connectors which I haven't used before this....lucky

Now the different sizes will fit inside each other. You know how much Ablion alloys charges for the same type of thing and I think I bought these much cheaper than that. The down side is they are all rather short.

BUT long enough for this job.They fit neatly over the brass tube I already had.The little blue bit is some heat shrink tube which just slides on easily.

I'v also been doing a bit of detail painting as the engine needs to be done before the frame is assembled.
Sorry about the lousy photography. It is actually a little more colorful than my skills show.

The rotor is still giving me trouble, not because my fix doesn't work. Because my skills are terrible and I can't drill in a straight line. Really need a secure way of clamping the small irregular shaped parts so all I have to worry about is keeping the drill bit straight.
It's giving me the S#@t's so I'v put it aside for now in disgust.

Post by **Twokidsnosleep** » Sat Dec 21, 2019 2:49 pm

Freaking brilliant

This will look superb
Cripes not only do you have to drill straight, you are upside down all the time too

Honestly, I don’t know how you do it

A Fine bit of modelling ingenuity

Post by **jmurphy18** » Sat Dec 21, 2019 6:28 pm

Ditto Scott here Digger!!

Post by **smokeriderdon** » Sat Dec 21, 2019 7:26 pm

Nicely done on the metal tubing! Great idea.

Post by **digger303** » Mon Dec 23, 2019 12:23 am

Twokidsnosleep wrote: Sat Dec 21, 2019 2:49 pm Freaking brilliant
This will look superb
Cripes not only do you have to drill straight, you are upside down all the time too
Honestly, I don’t know how you do it
A Fine bit of modelling ingenuity

jmurphy18 wrote: Sat Dec 21, 2019 6:28 pm Ditto Scott here Digger!!

smokeriderdon wrote: Sat Dec 21, 2019 7:26 pm Nicely done on the metal tubing! Great idea.

Thanks guys for the smack on the back, but totally unwarranted I can assure you. Managing to hang upside down by my toes OK.

However I only managed to drill one almost straight the other 3 were all over the shop and I totally screwed it up. Plus the Ca grabbed a bit quicker than I moved and on is not close enough in. I'm seriously considering ordering 2 replacement sprues and having another go. I put them aside for a couple of days. While I procrastinate I can do some more on the fuselage if I can get some bench time in.
MERRY XMAS

Post by **Tomcat64** » Mon Dec 23, 2019 9:25 am

Really good save with the metal tubing solution mate - hope you manage to figure something out to get that sorted without needing to resort to replacement sprues though.

Post by **Twokidsnosleep** » Mon Dec 23, 2019 4:29 pm

Oh shoot
Hmm we gotta be able to trouble shoot this
If it fUBAR or can you take it/ cut it apart??
Show us some pics, we can brainstorm

Post by **digger303** » Tue Dec 24, 2019 4:52 am

Twokidsnosleep wrote: Mon Dec 23, 2019 4:29 pm Oh shoot
Hmm we gotta be able to trouble shoot this
If it fUBAR or can you take it/ cut it apart??
Show us some pics, we can brainstorm

OMG

Post by **Stokesy44** » Tue Dec 24, 2019 8:58 am

Great work so far.

I'm sure you'll sort the rotors out. Maybe fill in the FUBAR holes with sprue goo and start again? I've never used brass rod or anything similar so I'll just cheer on from the sidelines from now.

Only just caught this build but have flagged it up for following from now.

Post by **digger303** » Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:22 pm

Twokidsnosleep wrote: Mon Dec 23, 2019 4:29 pm Oh shoot
Hmm we gotta be able to trouble shoot this
If it fUBAR or can you take it/ cut it apart??
Show us some pics, we can brainstorm

Stokesy44 wrote: Tue Dec 24, 2019 8:58 am Great work so far.

I'm sure you'll sort the rotors out. Maybe fill in the FUBAR holes with sprue goo and start again? I've never used brass rod or anything similar so I'll just cheer on from the sidelines from now.

Only just caught this build but have flagged it up for following from now.

Thanks for the support guys. Bit embarrassed about posting any pic's of them however on inspecting them last night . Maybe I can live with them. I can shorten one piece of brass as I didn't cement that piece in and that discrepancy won't be that noticeable. The other one will as when the glue dried it pulled the part to one side due to the sloppiness ( huge drill hole ). Still I might leave it as it is impossible to extract ( tried acetone ) without total destruction of the small part and it is only really noticeable looking down over it and I could probably position the rotor to minimize that...maybe.

Merry Xmas

Stash · Post by **bfrd** » Tue Dec 24, 2019 11:26 pm

i think you are rocking this little bird.

Post by **Hawkmoon** » Wed Dec 25, 2019 12:03 am

Proxxon and Dremel do mini drill stands as do many other suppliers I know its a bit late for you but handy for future builds-

I have the Proxxon one and use it more than I ever thought I would.

Andy