Breaking the Tiger 1 virginity

[Donkeywalloper]

Good afternoon all

Well, I have taken the plunge and bought the following:

Tamiya 1/35 Tiger 1 early version grills.

Tamiya 1/35 Tiger I Early Production - 35216 (which is being said is a good model, I do hope so)


Now, what else could I buy to add to this much anticipated buy?

Can I replace tracks, and if so which are best Aber or Frui or is another choise out there?

Barrels?

Let me know please you Tiger 1 Sensi
John

[mannloon]

So I know you posted in my Tiger thread so as you probably know I am a fan of Tamiya 35216, it was a crazy easy and fast build, and it looks the part. As to the tracks you should get, I cannot say enough how pleased I am with AFV Club workable "hi-tech" track. There are Ejector pin marks on each link, which are mostly of the raised type, so easy to clean up. And that's a small price to pay for having no sprue gates. For plastic track. The assembly is easy, and man do they have a smooth articulation. After having built some Bronco Panther tracks this week, I can say the AFV Tiger tracks are miles above the Bronco tracks, which are around the same price after shipping.

I can't speak to Friul or Modelkasten as I've never built any. The consensus seems to be Friul are amazing, and modelkasten look great when assembled but are a huge pain to put together. When the Tiger SiG starts in January I will be getting AFV club late tiger tracks for my Zim Tiger.

I wasn't really in to after market when I started that kit, which was only a few months ago, but since I have come to replace all two piece barrels. I had a great experience buying RB Barrels from ebay. My Jagdpanther barrel was like $9 +$4 shipping I think from Poland and came right away and is just beautiful.

Keep in mind to make that kit really accurate you need to use different smoke grenade launchers on the turret as the ones in the kit don't have the notch the real ones do. I also added a "spare" Dragon loaders hatch bracket.

[Donkeywalloper]

So I know you posted in my Tiger thread so as you probably know I am a fan of Tamiya 35216, it was a crazy easy and fast build, and it looks the part. As to the tracks you should get, I cannot say enough how pleased I am with AFV Club workable "hi-tech" track. There are Ejector pin marks on each link, which are mostly of the raised type, so easy to clean up. And that's a small price to pay for having no sprue gates. For plastic track. The assembly is easy, and man do they have a smooth articulation. After having built some Bronco Panther tracks this week, I can say the AFV Tiger tracks are miles above the Bronco tracks, which are around the same price after shipping.

I can't speak to Friul or Modelkasten as I've never built any. The consensus seems to be Friul are amazing, and modelkasten look great when assembled but are a huge pain to put together. When the Tiger SiG starts in January I will be getting AFV club late tiger tracks for my Zim Tiger.

I wasn't really in to after market when I started that kit, which was only a few months ago, but since I have come to replace all two piece barrels. I had a great experience buying RB Barrels from ebay. My Jagdpanther barrel was like $9 +$4 shipping I think from Poland and came right away and is just beautiful.

Keep in mind to make that kit really accurate you need to use different smoke grenade launchers on the turret as the ones in the kit don't have the notch the real ones do. I also added a "spare" Dragon loaders hatch bracket.

Mate that is great to know that I may have got myself a nice model, thanks so much for time taken out for advice .

The kit should arrive this week and then have a weekend alone to check and sort my build out.

Thank you,
John

[Ozzie21]

Oh I would use Fruil tracks as you just can't beat them and add Aber or RB models or Lion Roar gun barrel

Ozzie21

[mannloon]

I would agree, except keep in mind AFV workable are half the price as Friul, so for people like myself on a budget, AFV is the way to go.

[Donkeywalloper]

Hi both

Thanks for input.

A RB Barrel is winging its way from Poland as I speak.

The Fruil Tracks are ace but at £30 for a set, its a bit steep for my taste. Maybe in the future.
I shall keep looking for the AFV set for meantime.

John

[Ozzie21]

Yes the AFV club tracks are a lot cheaper but I find they fall apart half the time as the set I tried just didn't seem to clip together well. I ended up gluing them. Hence I buy where possible Fruil tracks and hold off on buying another kit for a couple of weeks. I also like the weight that the Fruil tracks impart to the model.

Ozzie21

[Donkeywalloper]

Yes the AFV club tracks are a lot cheaper but I find they fall apart half the time as the set I tried just didn't seem to clip together well. I ended up gluing them. Hence I buy where possible Fruil tracks and hold off on buying another kit for a couple of weeks. I also like the weight that the Fruil tracks impart to the model.

Ozzie21

Well in for a penny in for a lot of Euro's.
Well 30 to be exact.
Your advice taken Ozzie, Set of Early Friul Track for Tiger 1 ordered this morning.
Never built these type of tracks before, but seen the demonstration video on ISM so will have a few more views to get a hang of the assembly.
Watched it a bit last night, so know about reaming out the two holes with a drill / Auger to clear obstructions (one is all the way through and other is 80% before a stop).
Should be a bit of fun and a chance to use some of that AK Burnishing Liquid.....
All adds to the excitement though.
Thanks for advice chaps,
John

[Donkeywalloper]

Keep in mind to make that kit really accurate you need to use different smoke grenade launchers on the turret as the ones in the kit don't have the notch the real ones do. I also added a "spare" Dragon loaders hatch bracket.

Hi ML

To make the notch. Should I go down the road of using my Dremel to cut notches or can you buy them?
Thanks as always,
John

[Ozzie21]

Donk, watch when drilling as it's easy to go right through the last little bit. Use a drill that just fits as if the hole is too big the CA goes into the link and hey presto it's solid. I also found that it's best to leave the wire a little longer than you need that way you can run the CA down the wire onto the track pivot and trim it off when dry. Lucky you can get the AK burnishing fluid. I tried but my usual suppliers don't seem to stock it. They are time consuming so assemble them in lengths of 10 as it seems to make the time go faster. First set I did for a King Tiger took the length of a "Bridge Too Far" to assemble.
Have fun

Ozzie21

Yes the AFV club tracks are a lot cheaper but I find they fall apart half the time as the set I tried just didn't seem to clip together well. I ended up gluing them. Hence I buy where possible Fruil tracks and hold off on buying another kit for a couple of weeks. I also like the weight that the Fruil tracks impart to the model.

Ozzie21

Well in for a penny in for a lot of Euro's.
Well 30 to be exact.
Your advice taken Ozzie, Set of Early Friul Track for Tiger 1 ordered this morning.
Never built these type of tracks before, but seen the demonstration video on ISM so will have a few more views to get a hang of the assembly.
Watched it a bit last night, so know about reaming out the two holes with a drill / Auger to clear obstructions (one is all the way through and other is 80% before a stop).
Should be a bit of fun and a chance to use some of that AK Burnishing Liquid.....
All adds to the excitement though.
Thanks for advice chaps,
John

[Donkeywalloper]

Thank you Ozzie for hints and tips .
Just this morning ordered the tracks via Friul (£32).
As I have never built this type of track before it should be fun.
I'll just take my time and see how I get on.
Thanks for looking in mate.
John

[alextheblue]

Looking forward to seeing you build this one up John!!

You won't regret getting the Friulmodel tracks either; once you've forgotten the initial pain of how much they cost and got them onto the tank - they're worth every penny. I've only built one set of these so far (also for a Tiger I funnily enough) and one thing I found useful was to feed the wire into the links by using your side-cutters rather than by hand. If you hold the wire nice and gently between the jaws, I found it wouldn't bend quite so easily and you can feel when it hits the other side of the link.

Best of luck - think you'll enjoy this one!

[Donkeywalloper]

Cheers Alex
God the price, my missus will murder me.....
Well it's my money so I don't have to justify it (but I do, I do).
Your the second person to mention the placing wire in pliers hint and pushing into hole and up to stop.
Once in then you can nip off wire and apply a dab of "Thick" Super.
Have I got it right so far
I want to take my time with this build as its for a very special chap i.e. Coen (you may have heard his name mentioned once or twice on here ).
Its for the "Tiger Tank SIG in honor of Coen C(Jan. 1st-April 1st 2015)" my first SIG and very excited to be a part of it to.
It looks a good kit and the RB barrel that I have ordered should compliment.
Still loving your Merk, hope to see some more jottings soon?
Best wishes,
John

[alextheblue]

Absolutely spot on!

When you first see all the links, you think.. ,but it doesn't actually take too long and its quite therapeutic (a bit like basket weaving for the "mentally challenged", but aren't we all a bit special!).

I've already thrown my hat in the ring for the Coen Tiger tribute build, only problem is, I've not long finished the only Tiger kit in my stash. Still gives me a great excuse to go and get another one!

Merk's coming along ok, thanks for asking and funnily enough I have a set of Friulmodel tracks for it winging their way to me - maybe we can have an AM track buddy build!!!

[Donkeywalloper]

I am special, thats what the missus thinks
You know at this rate we'll all be tramps on street with no houses and no money....but what a lark it was building models and spending that cash
John

[Coen]

I've used that kit that you've got there twice before for conversions John. It's a great base kit for any tiger build. It could stand a bit of improvement though. You've already gone to great lengths to fix that. PE grills, tracks, new barrel. I usually replace all the tool clamps and tow cables and clamps as well. But I'm a nutter and I do stuff like that.
Those fruil tracks are absolutely wonderful. Once you get into the assembly it very quickly becomes routine. I can do a full set of tiger tracks in two hours now, sometimes less if I'm not watching a good vid. haha.
The modelkasten kits are ok with the detail but a PITA to build, so are bronco. AFV club are good for the detail (I have a set here that I just got it, and there's a set going on my Tunisian Tiger I), but they're very delicate after they're built. As long as you prepare yourself for that they're ok.
All in all it sounds like you're preparing very well for a wonderful build.
If you're looking for any more additions... you can replace the tool clamps with PE, the exhaust shrouds with PE and the smoke launchers with PE.
The notch in the launchers can be replicated with a small file if you have one. Just make a small notch with that. It's very small and you only have to suggest it to fool the eye. Unless you're planning on letting a rivet counter withing 3cm of your launchers.

[Donkeywalloper]

Cheers Coen fr your wise words
I'm not gonna go all anal (whoops am I gonna be hit by the PC Police for that, but you get my drift) on this.
First Tiger, and just want to produce a great model and enjoy the build and learn from it.
I am going to notch the Smoke Dischargers, and if I can get hold of some PE for tool clamps then I shall have a bash at them.
Have you any contacts for good PE for this early type Tiger oh wise one ?
This is supposed to be for a SIG build not starting till the 1.1.15, but now it's in my grubby paws , I really want to have a bash now.
Thanks for kind words mate,
Speak soon.
John

[Donkeywalloper]

Well very impressed with Fruil.
Tracks arrived this morning in post after a week from order.
Arn't they pretty when you get them out of the box.
Like little individual masterpieces.
I had the box open in the Kitchen (Just the two bags and wire, not every peice scattered around me like a kid on Christmas morning ) and was gazing fondly on them and taking big endearing looks at each pack and envisaging them locked together on the Tiger.
My wife's face was a picture.....who can blame her
Peace and Love.
John

[mannloon]

I wish I had replaced the clamps and cables on my Tiger I. Coen may seem "a nutter" but man when those details are upgraded the tank really sings.

[Donkeywalloper]

I wish I had replaced the clamps and cables on my Tiger I. Coen may seem "a nutter" but man when those details are upgraded the tank really sings.

Man, the price though of all of those upgrades just gets ridiculous after a time and even now I have to question the finances of some of this. It is expensive....
I wish the manufacturers would start to look at ways of incorporating these bits and bobs (Up-Grades) into models.
Yeah, the cost to them would be somewhat but wouldn't the Modelling fraternity as a whole start to buy better detailed units if produced?
This Tiger cost £30 but even now the price of this unit with upgrades is now over a £100.
Take care mate,
John

[mannloon]

I wish I had replaced the clamps and cables on my Tiger I. Coen may seem "a nutter" but man when those details are upgraded the tank really sings.

Man, the price though of all of those upgrades just gets ridiculous after a time and even now I have to question the finances of some of this. It is expensive....
I wish the manufacturers would start to look at ways of incorporating these bits and bobs (Up-Grades) into models.
Yeah, the cost to them would be somewhat but wouldn't the Modelling fraternity as a whole start to buy better detailed units if produced?
This Tiger cost £30 but even now the price of this unit with upgrades is now over a £100.
Take care mate,
John

I was just having this conversation with TexasAndy on youtube. I completely agree. I wasn't by any means telling you to spend more money. I actually hack and slash spare styrene parts and tools together to accomplish want I want. I think scratch built and kit bashed upgrades are fine. That's the problem with these easy build and pretty good tooling Tamiya kits. They are a pleasure to build, but to bring them up to standard they require another 2x the money to finish.

My last two builds have been 90's Tamiya base kits with aftermarket. But the majority of what I buy is modern Dragon kits so that I don't have to spend so much on aftermarket.

[Donkeywalloper]

I wish I had replaced the clamps and cables on my Tiger I. Coen may seem "a nutter" but man when those details are upgraded the tank really sings.

Man, the price though of all of those upgrades just gets ridiculous after a time and even now I have to question the finances of some of this. It is expensive....
I wish the manufacturers would start to look at ways of incorporating these bits and bobs (Up-Grades) into models.
Yeah, the cost to them would be somewhat but wouldn't the Modelling fraternity as a whole start to buy better detailed units if produced?
This Tiger cost £30 but even now the price of this unit with upgrades is now over a £100.
Take care mate,
John

I was just having this conversation with TexasAndy on youtube. I completely agree. I wasn't by any means telling you to spend more money. I actually hack and slash spare styrene parts and tools together to accomplish want I want. I think scratch built and kit bashed upgrades are fine. That's the problem with these easy build and pretty good tooling Tamiya kits. They are a pleasure to build, but to bring them up to standard they require another 2x the money to finish.

My last two builds have been 90's Tamiya base kits with aftermarket. But the majority of what I buy is modern Dragon kits so that I don't have to spend so much on aftermarket.

No, I understood mate what you were saying.
Everything you say though is spot on. I am going to have a bash with a Dragon next.
This kit is supposed to be for the SIG Coen Build, but to be honest buddy I will not make it.
It starts on the 1.1.15 and think this will be built before then.
I'll do this, and then buy a really nice Dragon Tiger (any suggestions as you have more experience) and use that as the SIG.
I really, really hope manufacturers take notice of the customers but I fancy that is just in the wind.
Take good care,
John

[mannloon]

Coen is the Tiger expert, pretty sure he's built a number of Dragon Tigers. I have Dragon's Late with Zimmerit 6383 kit lined up for the Coen Tiger SiG. The only thing I will be replacing is the tracks. I don't much care for DS tracks with German armor, so despite the hollow guide horns on the DS, I'll be going AFV Club or Friul.

Dragon Tigers that are easily available and or good...if we go back to the 2005 retools you have 6252 which is an initial Leningrad Tiger 3 in 1. Runs a bit expensive now, but it has that large PE and metal parts case with a barrel and all kinds of goodies. There is a newer and cheaper smart kit version 6600, single piece plastic barrel, less goodies but at least the grills and standard stuff will all be up to standards.

There is a brilliant late tiger kit (I just tried to get on ebay but was unwilling to pay over $60 for) 6253. It has PE fenders, and exhaust shrouds, metal barrel, rounds, bucket, you name it. Apart from the fact it has no zimmerit molded on or included, it seems to be the holy grail of late Tiger kits. It comes with the option to make Michael Wittman's 007 command tank, it's quite awesome. Again there was a newer smart kit version without the goodies numbered 6406. It's just becoming hard to find so the price has gone up to where it makes no sense to buy that one instead of 6253. Where as 6383 is essentially the same kit without some extra bits but with molded on Zimmerit.

6700 is a very new kit so can be obtained for middle ground prices and is the only Dragon standard Mid-production variant out I know of. It has the molded on Zimmerit as well.

So to sum that nonsense up, 6700 mid-production w/ Zim and 6383 late w/ Zim are both in the $40-$50 U.S. range and would build pretty well out of the box except that they have DS tracks.

The older kits with all of those goodies for me run about $80-ish on ebay, I've seen people get deals on them though. So they'll be more expensive but have Magic Tracks and PE, metal barrels etc. and wouldn't require aftermarket stuff.

Now none of this mentions the Cyber Hobby Orange Box early Tiger 9142. I will be buying one shortly. It's a complicated kit. It has some simplified construction similar to 1/48 kits. Molded on swing arms, no torsion bars for articulated suspension. The wheels are oddly connected and some say lack detail. It's $29 US on scalehobbyist though, and shares many sprues with all of these high end Tiger kits. And it still has PE grills and a single piece barrel. I love Tamiya 35216 but I have to admit the final product of the Cyber Hobby kit would look more the part in the end out of the box. Again though DS tracks. So I'd replace them at least.

My advice is Watch Coen's review of 9142 and look up the Dragon Tiger lineage on scalemates and just look at the kits.

[Coen]

I'm not a nutter... I'm special.


ahahaha.

Manloon is right, 9142 is a fair kit for an interesting build.
There's a new development with that kit though... I've heard recently that some of the boxes are missing a road wheel or two. So until that gets sorted out by Dragon I'd avoid the kit unless you're like me and a few other tiger nuts and have a half dozen wheels laying around from previous builds.

6252 is a gorgeous kit that builds into some really interesting versions of the tiger. If you can find it for a good price (less than £30) you're doing good. It's one of my favourites.

[Donkeywalloper]

Man & Coen, brilliant buddies (just what ISM is all about).
The sheer knowledge of you chaps.
I'm going to go down the Dragon path ( ) and find myself a real fun build. Pleanty of time to look.
Again, thank you, you two seers of Tiger knowledge
John

[mannloon]

I have an order of Tigers coming in from scalehobbyist. 9142 and 6700. My knowledge of most new Dragon Tiger kits is from research, so now i'll get to open up and eventually build these so I should know more. They're the only kits besides the late with Zimmerit i can buy new online, which i already have.

[Ozzie21]

Man & Coen, brilliant buddies (just what ISM is all about).
The sheer knowledge of you chaps.
I'm going to go down the Dragon path ( ) and find myself a real fun build. Pleanty of time to look.
Again, thank you, you two seers of Tiger knowledge
John

Donk, if your going down the Dragon path then get a late model panzer IV kit. Absolute joy to build and a perfect partner for the Tiger I and Tiger II.

Ozzie21

"Keep the CA off the fingers"

[Donkeywalloper]

Man & Coen, brilliant buddies (just what ISM is all about).
The sheer knowledge of you chaps.
I'm going to go down the Dragon path ( ) and find myself a real fun build. Pleanty of time to look.
Again, thank you, you two seers of Tiger knowledge
John

Donk, if your going down the Dragon path then get a late model panzer IV kit. Absolute joy to build and a perfect partner for the Tiger I and Tiger II.

Ozzie21

"Keep the CA off the fingers"

Ozzie